GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down
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Bad Karma -> System Help

#1: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:44 pm
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Hey guys,

Before I left for my trip, my system was really starting to lag and then the day I left the system would just shut down after 10 mins or so.

When I got back, figured it out was the GPU overheating.  It is an ATI 4890.  I opened up the case, put a box fan right next to it and turned it on high.  I can run the computer fine with temps in the low 70s (C), but when I turn on BlackOps with all graphic settings on low, it is running at 100-115 (C).  I saw an extra cooling fan on amazon that takes up one of your slots right next to the GPU for $15 I can get.

What do you think?  Bad card?  Will the fan do the trick?  Any ideas, other solutions are welcome.  Thanks!

PastorDan

#2: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: KulamonsterLocation: PA PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 8:25 pm
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PastorDan,

The 4980 was built to run on the hot side, but I think the 100-115C is over that limit!  I know AMD (ATI) rates the card under full load to normally run between 80-95C, and that is what they warranty.  1st thing is have you gotten the dust bunnies out of the Graphics Card.   Built up dust on the fan will slow it down so that will increase heat.  Second a lot of the ATI and nVidia Cards you can buy third hand replacement fans for the graphics cards which work better than the factory stock fans.  You are not that much hotter than recommended temps, so cleaning your existing fan, putting on a replacement fan, or getting a fan card to pop in next to the graphics card, should do the trick for you.

AFTER MARKET FAN for 4890: http://www.zalman.com/eng/product/Product_Read.asp?idx=338

#3: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: Silent_WolfLocation: Loveland, Colorado PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 8:27 pm
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before you start spending big money, open up you gfxs card.  Remove the heat sync, clean it all up.  Remove all the thermal paste from the card and the GPU and put some new thermal paste on.  You could only need about half the size of a pea either on the GPU or the heat sync.  It may sound weird but the thermal paste is VERY important and if it gets to hot it can get hard and stop working.

#4: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: LukeLocation: Grand Rapids, MI PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 8:30 pm
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I had that happen to me back when I had a desktop. I just pulled the heat sync and cleaned it. Then I went to best buy and got some new heat sync past and put some on.

Hope that helps.
GOA.Luke*BK*

#5: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: AbramLocation: Fort McMurray, AB PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:56 pm
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Yepp. A good cleaning and some thermal paste will do it well. My case stays quite clean, but my past few video cards  have always been the first components to get clogged up, as they used the impeller-style fan, as the  4890's do, If memory serves.

Of course, make sure the fan isn't dead. If so, then you'll have to get another cooler. If your case tends to get toasty, I'd suggest one that pushes the warm air out the back. I had an Arctic Cooling VGA cooler on my 9800 a while ago. It was fairly cheap, and performed very well.

#6: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: BolerroLocation: Warshington (state) PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 1:43 am
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Also check the fan speed under normal and heavy load. If you don't hear it noticeably increase in speed going to heavy load, then you may have a bad fan. One way I found to test the fan is to touch it just enough to stop it and then let it go. It should take right off quickly and be back up to normal speed almost instantly. If the bearings are going bad, it will slowly speed back up and you can usually hear a small amount of grinding (friction) as it spins back up.

#7: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: UFANS PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 12:37 pm
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Silent_Wolf wrote (View Post):

before you start spending big money, open up you gfxs card.  Remove the heat sync, clean it all up.  Remove all the thermal paste from the card and the GPU and put some new thermal paste on.  You could only need about half the size of a pea either on the GPU or the heat sync.  It may sound weird but the thermal paste is VERY important and if it gets to hot it can get hard and stop working.


Thats where I would start, and since your in there do the same for the CPU.  Make sure to get all the paste off, q-tips and rubbing alcohol works great and drys fast.  If you can get it use Arctic Silver 5, IMO its the best stuff out there.

#8: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:12 pm
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I took the GPU out and it was a mess with dust and gunk!  No wonder it didn't work.  I went head and took it apart and cleaned each piece.  Bought thermal compound and after cleaning the old paste off and cleaned the surfaces off.  Applied the new paste, put it all back together, so keeping my fingers crossed!

#9: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: Silent_WolfLocation: Loveland, Colorado PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 9:01 pm
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Come on now, dont leave us hanging.........Did it work?

#10: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:51 am
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Nope.  Still overheating...

I can play, but I have to open up the side panel and put a box fan full blast.

#11: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: mr-t PostPosted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:06 pm
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now this may seem like a stupid question but does the fan still work for one and also doe the fan speed up when you start the game ect if you fan is not spinning fast enough it will not be pulling the heat way

#12: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: BolerroLocation: Warshington (state) PostPosted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:41 pm
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Pastor Dan, I re-read your symptoms and sorry for missing it in the first posting. If your system is completely shutting down and not doing a video lock up, then it is most likely not the GPU. When a GPU overheats, you get anomalies like artifacts first and then your whole video will lock up. I have not yet seen a video card shut a system down as it does not have the ability to tell the motherboard it is overheating. The MB has sensors in various spots on the primary chips like CPU, north-bridge, etc that tell it what the temps are. When those temps hit a threshold, it shuts down to protect itself.

First step is to remove the heat sink from the CPU and do the same thing you did with your GPU. Clean fan, replace old paste, etc. You can also remove the heat-sinks from the other chips and do the same thing. Basically a complete cleaning and paste replacement on all heat-sinks.

If this doesn't work to resolve the issue, then quite honestly the only thing remaining that I can think of that would make a system do a shutdown is the power supply. If your power supply is not functioning properly under load, then it just won't have the power to run your system and the power supply will shutdown.

So since you already have the paste, I would suggest the cleaning of the main chips and see what happens. If it still happens, then power supply replacement may be necessary.

Also, just a suggestion. Get into the habit of blowing the PC out every 2-3 months to get rid of dust bunnies and at least once a year do a complete tear down and cleaning. Replacing the old paste and any worn out fans. This will help keep it in optimal gaming condition.

(which reminds me... I need to clean mine... hope this helps)

#13: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 8:42 pm
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Bolerro...thanks for the suggestions, I will give them a try today...It can't hurt me!

#14: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HeHawKilLerLocation: Medicine Hat, Alberta PostPosted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 10:43 pm
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Bolerro wrote (View Post):

Pastor Dan, I re-read your symptoms and sorry for missing it in the first posting. If your system is completely shutting down and not doing a video lock up, then it is most likely not the GPU. When a GPU overheats, you get anomalies like artifacts first and then your whole video will lock up. I have not yet seen a video card shut a system down as it does not have the ability to tell the motherboard it is overheating. The MB has sensors in various spots on the primary chips like CPU, north-bridge, etc that tell it what the temps are. When those temps hit a threshold, it shuts down to protect itself.

First step is to remove the heat sink from the CPU and do the same thing you did with your GPU. Clean fan, replace old paste, etc. You can also remove the heat-sinks from the other chips and do the same thing. Basically a complete cleaning and paste replacement on all heat-sinks.

If this doesn't work to resolve the issue, then quite honestly the only thing remaining that I can think of that would make a system do a shutdown is the power supply. If your power supply is not functioning properly under load, then it just won't have the power to run your system and the power supply will shutdown.

So since you already have the paste, I would suggest the cleaning of the main chips and see what happens. If it still happens, then power supply replacement may be necessary.

Also, just a suggestion. Get into the habit of blowing the PC out every 2-3 months to get rid of dust bunnies and at least once a year do a complete tear down and cleaning. Replacing the old paste and any worn out fans. This will help keep it in optimal gaming condition.

(which reminds me... I need to clean mine... hope this helps)


Actually a GPU can shut down a system, just depends on the errors.  I had a GPU that would always crash my system, but powersupply sounds more like it.

#15: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: R_OReillyLocation: Massachusetts, USA PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:16 pm
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Yup, PS was what I was thinking as well.  I've had several go bad in just that way.  Normal usage, web browsing OK.  Gaming, shutdown after an ever decreasing number of minutes.  It's the current draw on the PS when you have all the bells and whistles going.  I try to start out with a PS that's 25-40% bigger than what I need as components degrade over time.  That way the supply lasts a bit longer for not too much more money.

#16: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HawkeyeLocation: Connecticut PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:33 pm
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Disclaimer: DO NOT DO ANY OF THE BELOW MENTIONED UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING!!! I TAKE NO RESPONSIBILITY, THIS IS ONLY TO HELP AND TO USE AS A GUIDE!!

I had a similar problem and it wound up being my PSU (Power Supply). I downloaded and ran a Hardware Monitoring software HW Montior

It helps if you have 2 monitors running so that when it happens, you can see what might have caused it, like if it's Video Related or CPU cause you can watch the Voltages and Temperatures  here.

If you can't do that with 2 monitors then at least run it on your desktop, as mine started to shut down (after a while) even when i was opening a word doc or IE. I also tested my PSU with a multimeter http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/ht/power-supply-test-multimeter.htm and a Paper clip-(don't try this unless you know what you are doing) This has to be done with it completely disconnected from your computer and the paper clip has to be in the right holes. http://www.overclock.net/faqs/96712-how-jump-start-power-supply-psu.html
 
I hope this helps?

#17: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HawkeyeLocation: Connecticut PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:45 pm
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Or, you can just go get another PSU and try it out..see what you have now and get something comparable, you can always take it back if that was not it, but you might have a restocking fee, depends where you get it. But if you plan on rebuilding in the future, get something that you can use then too, in case this is the problem. Or see if someone has one you can borrow.  Be-careful, if this is a Dell, they make their own PSU's proprietary so you can only replace with their stuff. I just thought this might have been a better choice to do in case you didn't want to do the multimeter thing...

#18: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 6:46 pm
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OK, just finished cleaning the fan, thermal paste off of the motherboard/CPU.  Reapplied Thermal paste and put back together.  Crossing my fingers.

I have a fairly new PS, so I hope it is not that.

#19: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HawkeyeLocation: Connecticut PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 7:46 pm
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I see you got disconnected again.....Look into trying another PSU...I had this similar thing happen to me and luckily for me, my PSU was still under warranty and they sent me out a new one....Not sure how old yours is...Heck, tell me how much yours is and I might have an old one you can have to trouble shoot it...The one I have is an oldie, it's an ATX-300...not sure if you can use it or not.....

#20: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 8:58 pm
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OK, it is still not fixed.  the GPU temps with a box fan blowing on it full blast is still 107c.

How can I check my PS as part of the problem?  How does that contribute to my GPU overheating?

#21: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HeHawKilLerLocation: Medicine Hat, Alberta PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:01 pm
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Have you made sure that the fan on the GPU is working?

#22: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: ted100Location: bracebridge ontario canada PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:20 pm
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pastor when u come ts we will talk i know ur issue .... maybe.......

#23: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: astro7730Location: Peterborough, Ontario Canada PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:23 pm
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i would uninstall and reinstall drivers to see if it is a driver issue. I have had the same issue in the past myself and this cured it. also If u have updated your graphics driver recently i would try to roll back to the old driver and see if this corrects this issue. as far as psu if just your graphics card is over heating shutting down your pc then it may very well be u have a defective card rather then psu. What size is your psu? what card do u have? processor? get back to me if u can.

#24: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 1:56 am
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Hey Ted:  Did all the steps we had talked about...same results.

Astro:  I did uninstall and then reinstall the ATI drivers as Ted had suggested.  My PSU is 750 Coarsair.  My GPU is an ATI Radeon XFX HD 4890.  I bought it Mar 2010.

#25: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: TakerDeep2008 PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:43 am
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Just for fun try an older driver version than you were...what can it hurt

#26: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: HeHawKilLerLocation: Medicine Hat, Alberta PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 6:11 am
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Did you see my comment? I think it's pretty important.

#27: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 7:58 pm
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HeHawKiller:  yes, the fan on the GPU is working, and I went into the controls and turned it on to be at 100% constantly.

#28: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: Silent_WolfLocation: Loveland, Colorado PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:24 pm
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PstorDan - Are you getting a BSOD when the system errors.  What is the BSOD code?

#29: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:59 pm
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No code or BSOD, the system shuts down, screen goes black.

#30: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: Silent_WolfLocation: Loveland, Colorado PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:25 pm
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Go into your bios screen.  Just let it sit there for awhile.  If it goes black at that point then its your motherboard.

#31: Re: GPU over heating, shutting the whole system down Author: PastorDanLocation: Columbia, MD USA PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:11 pm
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OK, I have no idea HOW to get my BIOS screen...let me see what I can find out...



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